tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17859011.post1429735752363494565..comments2024-03-28T19:21:17.654+00:00Comments on Evangelical Textual Criticism: Romans 16.3 as window into Codex VaticanusP.J. Williamshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04388225485348300613noreply@blogger.comBlogger21125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17859011.post-87971758287755436862019-06-10T22:16:45.234+01:002019-06-10T22:16:45.234+01:00Thank you for the clarification and additional inf...Thank you for the clarification and additional info about distinguishing points concerning "ekthesis" and "paragraphoi" markers. I would have to spend time looking at Vaticanus for the "infallible guide" to the short previous line of a text. I did not realize the "paragraphoi"are not original to the text of Vaticanus. From looking at Vaticanus (and not the CSNTM version) I see now that the "paragraphoi" markers appear to be from a different hand than the original scribal hand. Fascinating! Thanks again, Pete.Alistair McPhersonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10091547167755241417noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17859011.post-31957425671944697962019-06-10T21:54:50.490+01:002019-06-10T21:54:50.490+01:00It is probably worth distinguishing ekthesis (posi...It is probably worth distinguishing ekthesis (positioning of the first letter or so of a line out into the marginal space) from paragraphos (the small line to indicate a paragraph). Vaticanus does have paragraphs, but a short previous line of text is the only infallible guide to them. The paragraphoi are not original to the text of Vaticanus. <br />Peter M. Headhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03379103292621457026noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17859011.post-43527293613737551272019-06-10T15:12:41.599+01:002019-06-10T15:12:41.599+01:00Thanks, Alan, for your marvelous contributions in ...Thanks, Alan, for your marvelous contributions in the CNTR. Your updated website is a gem!Alistair McPhersonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10091547167755241417noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17859011.post-58326277318492110712019-06-10T14:09:11.943+01:002019-06-10T14:09:11.943+01:00Yes, I pipe up every once and a while.Yes, I pipe up every once and a while.Alan Bunningnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17859011.post-78871999111768099142019-06-10T08:50:00.742+01:002019-06-10T08:50:00.742+01:00Thanks a lot Alistair.
I didn't know the CNTR ...Thanks a lot Alistair.<br />I didn't know the CNTR website, it is really a treasure!<br />And the fact that you can also see the image of the manuscript and study it yourself.<br /><br />Do you know if Alan Bunning is active here on the blog?Dimitris Tsaknakishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04258266531248423414noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17859011.post-4196989083516405812019-06-09T21:08:45.113+01:002019-06-09T21:08:45.113+01:00Tim,
You are most welcome.
Have you checked out ...Tim,<br />You are most welcome. <br /><br />Have you checked out "The Center for the Study of New Testament Manuscripts" (http://www.csntm.org/)? A most excellent resource!<br /><br />Best,<br />AlistairAlistair McPhersonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10091547167755241417noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17859011.post-48130793639550043172019-06-09T17:20:18.409+01:002019-06-09T17:20:18.409+01:00Alistair,
Thanks for the ‘heads up’ on The Center ...Alistair,<br />Thanks for the ‘heads up’ on The Center for New Testament Restoration!<br />Dirk’s book is already on order!<br /><br />Thanks again,<br />Tim<br />Timothy Josephhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06641788186736340533noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17859011.post-48279620242466619872019-06-08T20:13:19.459+01:002019-06-08T20:13:19.459+01:00Hi Tim, yes, the ETC Blog is wonderful and enrichi...Hi Tim, yes, the ETC Blog is wonderful and enriching. Dirk Jongkind's latest small publication, "An Introduction to the Greek New Testament- produced at Tyndale House" (2019, 124 pages) is an excellent resource (along with the THGNT)! The Center for New Testament Restoration (https://greekcntr.org/collation/index.htm) is also a great resource. Along with the online digital resources it makes for wonderful studying of early Greek mss.Alistair McPhersonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10091547167755241417noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17859011.post-16825580075867989722019-06-08T20:00:11.221+01:002019-06-08T20:00:11.221+01:00This is awesome! Just seeing the input from the d...This is awesome! Just seeing the input from the different comments has directed me back to the text to see what else I missed. ETC at its best!<br /><br />TimTimothy Josephhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06641788186736340533noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17859011.post-84146190881712049902019-06-07T23:43:28.722+01:002019-06-07T23:43:28.722+01:00Hi Peter, I apprecaite your comments on "diar...Hi Peter, I apprecaite your comments on "diaresis". Because of the second "nu" offset to the left, it got me thinking about something completely different, namely, ekthesis markers and comparing other early mss for ekthesis at this section (Rom. 16:3ff).<br /><br />It seems that Vaticanus differs from Sinaiticus, Alexandrinus, Ephraemi Rescriptus, and Claromontanus (D06) in the way the scribe presents ekthesis markers.<br /><br />In Vaticanus, I see the scribe has a typical elongated line, written either immediately above a word and out to the left of the column, to indicate ekthesis (i.e., same in Rom 15:30, however, Παρακαλῶ starts mid-column, so the elongated line begins above the following word, δὲ in the column below).<br /><br />[An interesting side note (to me)--but not related to this section-- is Rom 7:25. Sadly, because P46 is lacunae from 6:16-8:14, we cannot know exactly how the phrase was written, i.e., "Thanks be to God..." or "I thank God..." Indeed, Vaticanus has χάρις τῷ θω; whereas Sinaiticus and Alexandrinus have Εὐχαριστῶ τῷ θω. The corrector of Sinaiticus has marginalia, χάρις δὲ.... And lastly, Claromontanus (D06) has Ἡ χάρις τοῦ θεοῦ.]Alistair McPhersonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10091547167755241417noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17859011.post-21209452298644662232019-06-07T20:17:14.446+01:002019-06-07T20:17:14.446+01:00Hi Benjamin, it seems the original scribe of Vatic...Hi Benjamin, it seems the original scribe of Vaticanus did write εργους μους; however, I wonder if perhaps this scribe attempted to remove/blot out the additional sigma? Visually, this sigma seems the lightest letter in this section (that Peter presented here). Alistair McPhersonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10091547167755241417noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17859011.post-82049405286752740042019-06-07T18:14:57.434+01:002019-06-07T18:14:57.434+01:00Sinaiticus, for example, has some very small sigma...Sinaiticus, for example, has some very small sigmas and some very small epsilons that are indistinguishable from each other. Did Vaticanus's exemplar have a very small epsilon in the word εΝ, which the scribe mistook for a sigma? I guess you could look for other such cases.Richard Fellowshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06777460488456330838noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17859011.post-4910047318867867492019-06-07T17:58:32.554+01:002019-06-07T17:58:32.554+01:00Another thing worth noting is the use of the two d...Another thing worth noting is the use of the two dots (diaresis) over initial upsilon in ὑπὲρ and ὑπέθηκαν alongside the rough breathing. This suggests two systems interacting rather than one complex system and that the two dots were part of the original text of Vaticanus (with e.g. Vercellone, 1868; and against Tischendorf, 1867) while the rough breathing is part of the reinker's accentuation work. Peter M. Headhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03379103292621457026noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17859011.post-79631023195350739432019-06-07T17:53:57.279+01:002019-06-07T17:53:57.279+01:00The original N is no re-inked, then the N is place...The original N is no re-inked, then the N is placed at the left of the line. Presumably different habits of word division across lines between the 4th and 11th centuries. Peter M. Headhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03379103292621457026noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17859011.post-62947985623019184802019-06-07T17:52:33.435+01:002019-06-07T17:52:33.435+01:00Spelling this name with EI is already present in P...Spelling this name with EI is already present in P46. The epsilon is carefully not re-inked. Peter M. Headhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03379103292621457026noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17859011.post-18843053827720551552019-06-07T17:49:35.307+01:002019-06-07T17:49:35.307+01:00Yes, I think so. The original error is interesting...Yes, I think so. The original error is interesting, and the care of "the thinking reinking" is also interesting. Peter M. Headhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03379103292621457026noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17859011.post-51039159205639951332019-06-07T17:43:42.556+01:002019-06-07T17:43:42.556+01:00Benjamin, considering the opposite side of the vel...Benjamin, considering the opposite side of the vellum reads iota (I), I'd say there was originally a sigma in the blank space. Probably caused by parabelipsis, OYCMOYC <br /> -M.M.R.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17859011.post-55325269782887304392019-06-07T16:58:05.577+01:002019-06-07T16:58:05.577+01:00Does it originally read εργους μους?Does it originally read εργους μους?Benjaminhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02909188430840299000noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17859011.post-40756469299959782472019-06-07T14:01:30.482+01:002019-06-07T14:01:30.482+01:00It's all Greek to me. Sorry, couldn't res...It's all Greek to me. Sorry, couldn't resist.StephanWolfhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00073765623197707519noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17859011.post-4197902106328866602019-06-07T13:09:00.906+01:002019-06-07T13:09:00.906+01:00Also, an "E" is added to the spelling of...Also, an "E" is added to the spelling of Prisca ("TTPEICKAN") <br /> -M.M.R.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17859011.post-35955387536401092622019-06-07T11:52:47.969+01:002019-06-07T11:52:47.969+01:00There appears to be an extra nu in the left hand m...There appears to be an extra nu in the left hand margin in the middle of the line break in the word συνεργούς.Timothy N. Mitchellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10696299768205488795noreply@blogger.com